I was watching a documentary last night and they touched on the time in Egypt when the pyramids were being built. In it, they showed them using long ramps to push and slide the stones up and into place as they pyramids were being built. As I was watching so many questions came to mind about how that just didn't seem possible. There would have been more engineering and materials in the ramp than in the pyramids themselves. Plus, then they would have to dismantle them and haul the material away when they were finished.
After some googling, I found this video.
In this guy's theory, they used water. For almost all of it. They would put the freshly carved limestone under water to use the water to level and square the stones as they shaped them. The water would also keep the stones fresh and easy to carve. And they could easily float the stones in order to move them. Then they built basically sealed water "elevators" to move the stones up the pyramid as it was built and to float them into place. Its really an ingenious theory that I had never heard. But it really makes perfect sense, especially from the standpoint that the water would keep them level at all times and would greatly reduce the engineering and masonry skill involved.
The drawbacks, obviously, are how do you contain and manage that much water, make sealed structures to make the elevator idea work, and, well, this is a desert. The pluses are that they had to lay one stone about every 3 minutes for 30 years to get those pyramids built. So dragging or pushing stones and building enormous ramps (not included in the 3 min/stone calc) is almost crazy.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:15 pm
by JCW
I thought it was aliens?
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:19 pm
by CaptQuint
Now I have a little experience in this, how does water keep "stones fresh and easy to carve"?
Now I used a huge stone saw with a rope diamond wire to cut the stones into blocks and used water to keep the wire from overheating. But I don't get that part.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:22 pm
by kwebber
Queue up WestTexasDunning-Kruger-effect to explain how it was all done, and that it was all trolls who built it to troll us here at UJR. The pyramids are actually on Vancouver Island, but he's testing us by saying they're in Egypt.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:28 pm
by Animal
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:19 pm
Now I have a little experience in this, how does water keep "stones fresh and easy to carve"?
Now I used a huge stone saw with a rope diamond wire to cut the stones into blocks and used water to keep the wire from overheating. But I don't get that part.
well, they explained in the video briefly. When limestone is freshly cut the air has not oxidized the surface and hardened it. By keeping it submerged you maintain the soft(er) state of the rock, which makes it easier to chisel or shape. PLUS, the water gives exact elevations to carve the stone perfectly level.
Whether or not they could construct the water shafts to raise the rocks onto the pyramid, this is a brilliant method to carve the stones prior to moving them. I think, at the time they built these pyramids, the only tools they had were stone tools or copper chisels.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:43 pm
by megman
What I find more of a mystery is how they created all these intricate passageways and hidden rooms.
They had to be done at the same time as the walls rose, so really how hidden were they at the time? There is a lot more to consider than the outside.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:46 pm
by Animal
megman wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:43 pm
What I find more of a mystery is how they created all these intricate passageways and hidden rooms.
They had to be done at the same time as the walls rose, so really how hidden were they at the time?
well, that's also an interesting part of the video (which is long, I know). Those hidden passageways, which are at rather steep angles, might have actually been part of the system that pumped (or gravity fed) the water from springs that was used to power this whole system of building them in the first place. In other words, they weren't mysterious passageways, only conduits for the water to travel through.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:19 pm
Now I have a little experience in this, how does water keep "stones fresh and easy to carve"?
Now I used a huge stone saw with a rope diamond wire to cut the stones into blocks and used water to keep the wire from overheating. But I don't get that part.
well, they explained in the video briefly. When limestone is freshly cut the air has not oxidized the surface and hardened it. By keeping it submerged you maintain the soft(er) state of the rock, which makes it easier to chisel or shape. PLUS, the water gives exact elevations to carve the stone perfectly level.
Whether or not they could construct the water shafts to raise the rocks onto the pyramid, this is a brilliant method to carve the stones prior to moving them. I think, at the time they built these pyramids, the only tools they had were stone tools or copper chisels.
Interesting, I used to cut sandstone and never really noticed a difference
megman wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:43 pm
What I find more of a mystery is how they created all these intricate passageways and hidden rooms.
They had to be done at the same time as the walls rose, so really how hidden were they at the time?
well, that's also an interesting part of the video (which is long, I know). Those hidden passageways, which are at rather steep angles, might have actually been part of the system that pumped (or gravity fed) the water from springs that was used to power this whole system of building them in the first place. In other words, they weren't mysterious passageways, only conduits for the water to travel through.
I don't buy it. And I don't think his theory holds water....
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:55 pm
by CaptQuint
I always found this Frenchmans theory most plausible
An internal ramp
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:55 pm
by Reservoir Dog
kwebber wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:22 pm
Queue up WestTexasDunning-Kruger-effect to explain how it was all done
You just KNOW that's gonna happen!
5 ... 4 ... 3 ... 2 ......
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:55 pm
by Animal
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:47 pm
Interesting, I used to cut sandstone and never really noticed a difference
Honestly, I haven't researched it. I'm just going by what the guy in the video said. He said that once quarried, the limestone surface reacts with CO2 in the atmosphere that hardens the surface. Obviously, you know that sandstone and limestone are not chemically the same. So, maybe sandstone doesn't have that same phenomenon.
I found this:
Coquina
An example of Coquina with characteristic shell deposits.
Coquina is an incompletely consolidated limestone composed of pieces of coral or seashells. It is created in association with marine reefs. It is composed mainly of calcite, often including some phosphate.
When first quarried, coquina is extremely soft. This softness makes it very easy to remove from the quarry and cut into shape. At first, however, the stone is too soft to be used for building. To be used as a building material, the stone is left out to dry for approximately one to three years, which causes the stone to harden, although the material still remains somewhat soft, as noted in the preceding paragraph.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:04 pm
by CaptQuint
Limestone
Limestone is commonly found in marine environments, and they are classified as sedimentary rocks. These are mainly formed in shallow, warm and calm waters. Biological activity also plays an important role in forming limestone. Normally, they are formed in waters where carbon dioxide concentration is low so that the sedimentation is quite easy. Marine water receives calcium from land. There is a lot of calcium carbonate containing materials, such as shells of mollusks and other sea animals, coral, skeletal structures of sea animals, etc. When these are accumulated in the form of calcite (other waste materials also tend to incorporate into this when accumulating), they are known as limestone. They are also categorized as biological sedimentary rocks. There is another type of limestone known as chemical sedimentary rocks. They are formed by direct precipitation of calcium carbonate in sea water. However, the biological sedimentary rocks are more abundant than chemical sedimentary rocks. In pure limestone, only calcite is there, but often they can contain impurities by mixing other materials like sand. So, limestone can be defined as a sedimentary rock, containing more than 50% of calcium carbonate in the form of calcite. Other than in oceans and seas, limestone can be formed in lakes or other water bodies with necessary conditions. In the world, limestone formation can be seen in Caribbean Sea, Indian Ocean, Persian Gulf, Gulf of Mexico, around Pacific Ocean islands, etc.
The nature of limestone depends on how it is formed. They can be in massive sizes, crystalline, granular, etc. They are classified into several groups according to their type of formation, composition or appearance. There are many classifications too. Some of the common limestones are chalk, coquina, lithographic limestone, oolitic limestone, fossiliferous limestone, tufa, etc. There are many usages of limestone too. They are commonly used as an ingredient for cement and glass manufacturing, hence an essential construction material. Since, limestone has a basic nature; it is used to neutralize acidic water bodies.
Sandstone
Sandstone is also a widely found sedimentary rock. It is formed in many environments such as oceans, lakes, deserts, etc. They are mostly formed by sand grains; therefore, contain quartz and feldspar in high quantities. Sandstone formation takes place in, Sahara desert in Africa, central Australia, Arabian deserts, western United States, etc. There can be different types of sandstones in various colors. Sandstones are used for cement or glass manufacturing. It has an aesthetic value, as well as an ornamental value. They can be cut, polished and then used as tiles or beautiful rocks for buildings or as monuments.
This is making me think I was incorrect and was quarrying Limestone
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:07 pm
by Animal
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:04 pm
This is making me think I was incorrect and was quarrying Limestone
maybe. sandstone is a bitch to cut. very very abrasive.
If you used to see "seashell" shapes in the rock, then it was limestone. limestone (around here) is almost white or gray in color. Sandstone is usually more brown to red.
CaptQuint wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:04 pm
This is making me think I was incorrect and was quarrying Limestone
maybe. sandstone is a bitch to cut. very very abrasive.
If you used to see "seashell" shapes in the rock, then it was limestone. limestone (around here) is almost white or gray in color. Sandstone is usually more brown to red.
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:19 pm
by Reservoir Dog
Wut wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:14 pm
they used helium balloons.
/thread.
Did you know that the world is running out of helium? Really, we are.
kwebber wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:22 pm
Queue up WestTexasDunning-Kruger-effect to explain how it was all done
You just KNOW that's gonna happen!
5 ... 4 ... 3 ... 2 ......
/ Actually my only comment was going to be that you could fill a library with all the theories over the last 2.500 years on how they got built. Just Amazing they could build those thousands of years ago.
Wut wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:14 pm
they used helium balloons.
/thread.
Did you know that the world is running out of helium? Really, we are.
We'd have more but the damn Egyptians used up so much of it.
Pennywise is gonna be pissed!
Re: Interesting Theory on Building Pyramids
Posted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:01 pm
by Animal
WestTexasCrude wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:52 pm / Actually my only comment was going to be that you could fill a library with all the theories over the last 2.500 years on how they got built. Just Amazing they could build those thousands of years ago.
this is the most credible theory that i have seen. its exactly the type of method that i would think a bunch of labor intensive guys would have come up with.
kwebber wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:22 pm
Queue up WestTexasDunning-Kruger-effect to explain how it was all done
You just KNOW that's gonna happen!
5 ... 4 ... 3 ... 2 ......
/ Actually my only comment was going to be that you could fill a library with all the theories over the last 2.500 years on how they got built. Just Amazing they could build those thousands of years ago.
The pyramids are at least 4,500 years old... but whatever.
